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Filip Vrlík: Your project Gnome has new way; way called "just works". There are no expert options, just simple config and that way. But some users are angry with this style and they are complaining till these days. So you prefer to stay this way?
Miguel de Icaza: It's longer replay. It's very longer replay. The goal of Gnome is to make computers accessible for normal people, right. Now, we are not a very big team. So, let me give you a few facts first. We want to make it usable for regular people, we want it to be robust, we want people to have robust desktop. We don't want to have bad reputation that Windows probably has. And it's propably good, but it doesn't matter, we don't want to have that reputation. Ehm. When people that are using Gnome feel that things are solid, right. That they just work, right.
They have a good experience. Very much like the Mac OS, right. I think that Mac OS is very popular and is geting very popular in the United States and it's the solid operating system. And this is very much like Gnome. They don't have lot of features or options. Ehm. What is interesting in the Mac - they give the very basics and then if you want expert tools like for example: you can always download some extra addons from somewhere, that will add you power features, right. But you don't have to make this standard operating system, that everybody's gonna use, have everything. So there is very strong emphasis on usability, simplicity.
And we spend, for example this last conference, we spend hours watching videos of people. We had people using Gnome on the camera looking at their hands and mouse, another looking at computer and another looking at the person talking. And we said: "Please, connect to the internet." And they were like: All right, what am I gonna do? These were Windows people. "Wow, what am I gonna do?" They found Firefox icon, clicked on that, they got Firefox. And then it was like they tried something like open up connecting. "How do I connect?" So they started exploring menus. So we take all of this to undestand what mistakes people make. So, we have right now, we have conducted about, I forgot that number, maybe fifteen of these interviews with people, maybe more. We send this team of usability people around, they actualy came to Europe to Sweden, Denmark, they have been all over US, to Germany I think. We have done these studies to understand how people use computers.
And now we have data improving Gnome to remove these problems. And looking at these studies is realy interesting, because you can see how people are having problems. Things that we as programmers take for self-evident. It was like, of course things you avoid. When you have a little problem you know the way out. So, we try to make these things and this is realy really important. So, our object is first: to make the things solid and second: to add options.
I will explain you the second part. Remember what I told a second ago, that we don't have enough people? Everytime you add an option like for doing two things, right. Everytime you make something confirmable. So you can do A or B. Like check box for example. That means that your program can take two paths, it can take one path or can take the other one. That means that, ehm, if you add features or you extend the program you need to test your code once and second time. You need to run your test twice. If things are perfect they go like this (Miguel shows it with hand gestures). There is only one path, now. Let's look at another option: in the worst possible case. In the best case they go like this you test this code path and this code path. Right, you test these paths. But what if they were compounded so now you have to test this path and this ones and then you have to test these two. So you can imagine it with hundred options. Testing macro becomes more complex and there is possibility that thing would not work, that they might just be weird. Right, that they even crash the application and people are gonna be complaining.
I think Linux desktop doesn't have so many developers as it should. We deciced, let's go for getting the basics right. And once we get basics right and rock solid, let's consider what the future has for us, right. So, I think there is a lot that can be done without adding thousands of options, because if you want thousands of options you can always say why don't you go download this from Sourceforge or from Freshmeat. But we will give people a working standard desktop, right. But if you want more stuff, we will tell you where you can get it. At the same time we have been working on insert things, an little candy. So this is like your main course, main meal, right. We have also been working on the dessert, on little things that will enhance your experience. So for example the new version of GTK uses Cairo for drawing, right. So its all vector based, you can actually zoom in buttons, zoom them out, you can rotate things, you can do a lot of crazy things. We have been working on hardware acceleratein Cairo, so that if you have an OpenGL hardware it will go like crazy. We have been working on nice effects for example in new version of desktop switching. When you move from one virtual desktop to the next, instead of clicking on a thumbnail you drag your desktop an it rotates like a cube. Really nice.
So as I understand it, Gnome focuses at this time on normal users, not on experts, but on normal people who want only use computers.
And this is the reason.
Everytime you graph somehing in population.
Bell curve, bell curve!
Perfect, you know exactly what I am talking about.
Problem is that experts are these guys and the idiots are these guys, they are very few. So we wanna focus our efforts on these people? No. Why don't we focus on these people? Right, cause it's much larger community, 89 %. Because these people are so good that they can go to Sourceforge and get something better or they can hack the software. These people are like - if their option is missing they edit the file or run Gentoo, they edit the file and rebuild something with their feature. That's why I don't care about these people, ehm, I care, but I'm not gonna do things only for them, I'm gonna do things for everyone. Does it make sense?
Yes
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Ono "ehm" a podobne jsem tam nechal v pripadech, kdy Miguel odskocil od tematu nebo se nahle pokousel dany problem vysvetlit jinou cestou. To je prirozene a delaji to vsichni. Pouzivame v reci mimiku, gestikulace, pomlky, ruzne pazvuky atd. Kdybych ale vse proste jen vynechal, tak se v tom muze ctenar ztratit. Zvlast kdyz dve vety po sobe na sebe vubec nenavazuji a najednou se mluvi o necem jinem. V takovych pripadech tam "ehm" je a predstavuje onen preskok. Taky potom cely rozhovor vypada prirozene, ze jsme se opravdu bavili mezi sebou, vysvetlovali neco, smali se a podobne, nepusobi tak kostrbate. O to mi slo - prehlednost, srozumitelnost a prirozenost.
Nikdo z nas asi neni anticky recnik, kupodivu ani sam Miguel. Ver mi, ze onech "mmm" je tam o hodne hodne vice. Ja taky nejsem anticky webzine autor, ale snazim se Kazdopadne ale diky za konstruktivni kritiku a nazor
Když se přesunete z jedné virtuální plochy na druhou, namísto klikání na náhled potáhnete vaši plochu a ona zarotuje jako krychle.Kde ja jsem to jenom videl? A, ze by Mac OS X? To, ze chteji delat desktop pro normalni lidi, je jejich vec. Nechapu ale, proc by se konfigurace desktopu mela zabyvat takovymi systemovymi vecmi, jako je nastavovani sitoveho rozhrani. Myslim, ze toto je uloha distributora – udelat pekne nastavovatko, ktere bude rozumet svym konfiguracnim souborum kdesi v /etc/sysconfig (pripadne jinde). Pokud pujdou touto cestou, tak vznikne jeden velky propletenec, v kterem se nikdo nevyzna. Uz vidim ty dotazy: „Kde si nastavim pripojeni k internetu?“ – „A pouzivas Gnome nebo KDE nebo XYZ?“
Pokud pujdou touto cestou, tak vznikne jeden velky propletenec, v kterem se nikdo nevyzna. Uz vidim ty dotazy: „Kde si nastavim pripojeni k internetu?“ – „A pouzivas Gnome nebo KDE nebo XYZ?“
Nedávno se mě někdo ptal, jestli se vyznám v Gnome a jestli jo, tak jak se připojí CDčko.
ale o to nejde. Jde o to, že na to abych si připojil CDčko se nemusím nutně "vyznat v Gnome", když stačí jeden příkaz v shellu.
.Ale ak má niekto taký prístup ako má je to len na jeho škodu.Nie na škodu iných
?
me take celkem staci mit misto jakehokoli dektopu/wm jen plochu s nejakym hezkym obrazkem a pak uz volam jen terminaly...
Delat vsak testy na windowsacich je imho spatne. hodne spatne. nejhorsi pocitacove navyky jsem si prinesl prave z tohoto systemu. ono je take dulezite si uvedomit, ze uzivatelske rozhrani windows je velmi zastarale a mam za to, ze jeho(win) uzivatelske rozhrani dnes spise deformuje, nez rozviji ci pomaha v praci.
- Ze by se nabizel (jako obvykle) kompromis? neco mezi xtermem a windowsUI? spraaavne... 
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